Slightly modified to give you an overall volume control but if you want the standard unit, just swap the 5K1 Volume 1 resistor for a 12K and solder between IC1 pins 6 and 7. Again it's small enough to fit in a 1590B with some careful measuring.
Updated: Delay 1 connects to the PT2399 pin 4, not to ground as shown on the original layout. The connection on the board is Mix 3, with Mix 1 going to ground.
Update 2: Now verified. Note the double link at pin 3 of the PT2399 to pin 4. Both pins need grounding.
Bjorn's spiel:
Deep Blue Delay (DBD) is a natural sounding digital/analog delay, with analog direct signal path. The DBD has about the same bandwidth as the classic tape echo units, and it can be used in front of an amplifier or in amplifier effects loops.
There are no noise reduction circuits, which keeps decay of echo as natural as possible.
The direct signal path is short and made with analog amplifiers with no filtering.
There should be no distortion or tone coloration as long as input level is in range below maximum allowed.
The echo signal has a tuned filtering to allow extreme settings without interference.
The delay is specially designed to work well with distorted tone, as this is the most critical application, where delays often fail.
You can use the pedal before or after distortion. As such, it will work exceptionally well on clean sounds where requirements are less stringent, especially in terms of echo bandwidth and repeat formation.
The delay tone has been carefully tuned with lot of attention to the first critical reflection and how the repeats decay.
There are no noise reduction circuits, which keeps decay of echo as natural as possible.
The direct signal path is short and made with analog amplifiers with no filtering.
There should be no distortion or tone coloration as long as input level is in range below maximum allowed.
The echo signal has a tuned filtering to allow extreme settings without interference.
The delay is specially designed to work well with distorted tone, as this is the most critical application, where delays often fail.
You can use the pedal before or after distortion. As such, it will work exceptionally well on clean sounds where requirements are less stringent, especially in terms of echo bandwidth and repeat formation.
The delay tone has been carefully tuned with lot of attention to the first critical reflection and how the repeats decay.
Finished today. Really goodsounding!
ReplyDeleteThank you very meny!
- Timppa
definitely my next build
ReplyDeleteYes mine too when I can finally get my bloody workshop sorted out!
Deleteim just waiting on my order from futurlec to come in. bought a bunch of their value packs. oh and if anyone is in the market for resistors, the makers of vero board sell a 4300 piece 1% metal film resistor pack of basically all the values you could ever need for a lifetime for around $30. i picked one up and am very satisfied.
ReplyDeleteHi,
ReplyDeleteWhat are the differences between the orange caps and red caps on the lay-out? I used MKT for all. Is that ok?
Thanks!
John
I use a lot of Panasonic caps which look like the red ones, but I used the orange symbol simply because those caps are only spanning two rows and so have a 2.5mm pitch. The smaller cap symbol looks cleaner on the layout than using the red symbols for the smaller gap which obscures the text. You can use any caps you want there, but box caps are quite good for a 2.5mm pitch because you can bend one leg back and then out again to the correct width, and it all ends up covered by the box to keep things neat. Or of course you could just use 2.5mm pitch ceramics, or multilayer ceramics if you want.
DeleteOk, thanks, I used MKT for all caps.
DeleteI'm gonna finish it soon.
Thanks!
Hi,
DeleteJust finished it, but
- Repeatknob doesn't seem to work, only get one repeat.
- it makes noise when engaged, kinda ticking, hissing
- don't understand update 2, because on freestomboxes.org I don't see schematics with pin4 to ground.
Do you have any ideas?
Thanks!
John
On FSB there's also a lot of people who seem to be having problems with it :o)
DeleteCheck out this post:
http://freestompboxes.org/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=713&start=100#p171137
When Used666 (who has posted on the FSB thread) built it at first, the PT2399 needed removing and reinstalling to reset it after every power down because it kept locking. Connecting pin 4 to ground cured it. I know that pin 4 is connected to ground internally within the IC, but it's via a low value resistor.
A few people have built this now so I know the layout is ok, so check for the usual things like solder bridges which shouldn't be there, bad solder joints etc. If you take a high res front and back pic I'll see if anything obvious stands out.
Oops, I forgot the 5K1!
DeleteIt works now, but still has a low motorboating sound to it. Can this be the regulator?
Thanks again!
Check that you're getting close to 5V at pin 1 of the PT2399. Also some PT2399's are noisy, do you have any others you can swap to check if it is the IC that is the problem?
DeletePin 1 is exact 5V.
DeleteI just ordered some PT2399's from Tayda. I heard those are good.
It sounds good, but it is noisy, so I hope it's the IC.
BTW why are there so many slight value differences compared to the volumemod schematic?
THANX AGAIN!
So it sounds like your regulator is alright, and you have a filter cap on the 5V as well. Like I said though, if you want to take a few pics then I can have a look and see if there is anything else that stands out.
DeleteI didn't think there was a lot of slight value differences. This is the schematic that I did the layout based on:
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j6/IvIark_2006/Layouts/Schematics/volume_mod.png
and the only value differences I thought was a 5K1 instead of 5K just to the right of the 2n2 caps, which I did because it was the closest logical value in the standard range that I keep on hand. And I swapped the 12K at the volume control for a 5K1 as well. I did this one because with a 12K you can never drop the repeats below unity, and I wanted the ability to make them quieter than the dry signal if I wanted to.
Here are some pics, not my best work ;-)
Deletehttp://www.johnklaver.nl/KlaverDbd.JPG
http://www.johnklaver.nl/KlaverDbd%20%282%29.JPG
Thanks, John
Nothing wrong with it, it gets harder to make the boards look like works of art every time when the parts count is reasonably high. Well all the values that are visible look ok to me, so I suspect that it's going to be the PT2399, or maybe noise from the regulator although I see you've also added the supply and ground to regulator caps too which should help. I'd socket the regulator with header pins as well to allow you to swap and change the two most suspect items. Apart from the background noise, does the timing and sound of the repeats seem ok? Again that would suggest that the rest of the circuit is ok.
DeleteOK, thanks,
DeleteYes, overall it sounds pretty good, but it's a bit too noisy and the noise it kinda connected to the mix, vol and del-knobs.
I will socket the regulator and wait for the new PT2399's. I hope it will be fine then.
Thanks!
Hi,
DeleteFinally got some new PT2399's. I also put in a new regulator in sockets and a NE5532P. It's much more quiet now, but still with the amp turned up it ads a noise. Maybe this is just part of a PT2399 delay? Thanks
Hi,
ReplyDeleteThis one drives me crazy. I started building it immediately when you posted. No sound. Few days later checked, and found a different picture (for the firs time I said oh god i made lots of mistakes). Rebuilt it, no sound again, couple of days later, new picture. Version 3 now, very loud, very noisy, i hear some repeats, but wont give up. :-)
I might rebuild it totally!
I had a request after the first layout I posted to ask if I could make it 1 row smaller because he didn't have veroboard large enough, which I managed to do. The second one I noticed I had messed up a label so Mix 3 connection on the board was marked up as Mix 1, so the third layout corrected that. I then noticed a missed link between IC2 pins 3 and 4 and the next layout corrected that. Both those updates were mentioned above.
DeleteThe only other changes I made were simply rejigging things about so the components were more evenly spread across the board, but the circuit was correct and remained the same.
Keep at it, we know this one is ok so you'll get there. If you want, post a high res front and back pic and I'll see if anything stands out. Oh and check it with other PT2399s as well, they can be a bit temperamental.
maybe a stupid question. would i be able to add a tap tempo switch into the circuit somehow?
ReplyDeleteYes, it should be easy enough to do. Let me have a look at it and I'll look at putting together a new layout, or maybe a daughterboard layout. I'll think about the best way to do it.
DeleteYou are the man.
ReplyDeleteI have a 125B I'm going to try to fit everything in. Unless you think an external box for the tap would be best.
DeleteI think you may need a 1590BB for this. The daughterboard will be a similar sort of size to the DBD board. You could potentially use an external box for it but the problem is that some components will need removing from the DBD board and so unless you switch them out (with an external tap tempo "on switch" or something), the DBD won't work correctly on its own. Plus you can have additional switches for tempo scale, double time and even add modulation and so the bigger box will be useful.
DeleteSo should I hold off on building the DBD board right now?
ReplyDeleteNo you can build it, maybe just leave out the 2K7 resistor and the delay pot connections for the timebeing. We'll probably still be including them but I need to find out the best way of doing it in terms of being able to set the delay time by tap tempo as well as manually by the delay pot. I don't know if this will need some kind of switching but I'll find all that out
DeleteI'm assuming ill need a momentary switch for the tap right
ReplyDeleteYou'll need a momentary SPST switch for the tap, 2 x SPST toggles for modulation and double time switch and 1 x SPDT on/off/on toggle for a tempo scale switch.
ReplyDeleteHere you go, this should keep you busy for a while :o)
ReplyDeletehttp://tagboardeffects.blogspot.com/2012/03/pt2399-tap-tempo-daughterboard.html
Hi,
ReplyDeleteI still have problems with this one. Works as a bad fuzz pedal, not really pot sensitive. Pictures uploaded here: (hope you will find something)
http://s1257.photobucket.com/albums/ii510/ntkrik75/
Along with my finished boxes as I promised a while ago.
Also have trouble with Mad Professor Fire Red Fuzz. No sound at all. Switched trannies, still nothing, only the 2n5485 made some noise. Could you send me the schematic? I have a pedalbuilder friend who builds Kasledereffects (the other pedals on my board, check it if you like, great builder), he might be able to find something.
Thanks in advance for the help and for the great layouts! (still have a couple of boards to work with)
Loved the man-cave photos, you are lucky to have it! :-)
Excellent thanks for the pics. What voltages are you getting at all the IC pins?
ReplyDeleteThis was the schematic I used for the Fire Red Fuzz. It uses my usual muff template that has been verified when used with other pedals but with the various value differences in core components, plus the additional JFETs instead of diodes for clipping.
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j6/IvIark_2006/Layouts/Schematics/bjffrf.png
I'll check over it again tomorrow to see if I can spot anything.
Hey I finished and tested this circuit as is on the layout. Works well but when I took the volume pot out, switched the 5k1 resistor for the 12k and tied the op275 pins 6 and 7 together, it stopped producing sound. That's my only problem. Maybe there's something I'm missing?
ReplyDeleteAnother thing, I tried to use Abfackeln's modulation circuit with this delay and it doesn't seem to work. I used it on the aqua boy last year and it worked wonderfully. I switched out the LDR and got a different led type to no avail. Any thoughts?
Ben
No you need to remove the 5K1 and then put the 12K between pins 6 and 7. There's no link.
DeleteAh that makes sense. I completely opened the circuit. Guess I wasn't paying attention. Thanks. Any ideas why the modulation circuit won't work? As far as I can tell, it only slightly changes the Delay Time resistance to produce the change in pitch, so it should work for most delays.
DeleteI don't know what it is, have you got a link?
DeleteOh ok. Yes, see if this works.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.sabrodesign.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/Modulation.gif
Well that is designed for an analog delay so I've no idea if it would work with a PT2399, but if it needs connecting to the delay pin, that would be pin 6, or the Delay 2 & 3 connection if you wanted to keep the time resistor in circuit. If you connect to pin 4 you're just grounding the output of the modulation board.
DeleteI just wanted to add some potentially helpful info to anyone building the DBD. I've built 2 of these circuits.. one of them was with the cheap caps from tayda and the other with more expensive caps including silver mica caps. the tayda circuit came out very noisy. It took 4 different pt2399's to get the noise/hiss down to an acceptable level. The other DBD came out perfect the first time... zero noise/hiss. I even tried swapping the pt2399 to find a noisier one and they all sounded good.. so I gather that the circuit is just very sensitive to having good quality parts/caps in it. (both circuits had xicon metal film resistors throughout and pt2399's from tayda)
ReplyDeleteThanks for the info. Who said caps don't make an audible difference eh?! :o)
DeleteHey Unknown what type of cheap capacitors you used from tayda? considering using MKT(polyester film).....
ReplyDeleteHi and thanks for the best site ever for gearfreaks whit an soldering iron
ReplyDeleteIv just bulit the pedal using your layout and it works fine except for one small thing.
The noise that alot of people are getting or hiss sound thats not what is my problem i think, this is what happens.
If i play soft on my guittar the delay works clean but if use more attack and play harder the signal gets a distortion sound.
Of course i wonder if you have an idea of what is wrong?? Since the pedal works clean when playing soft but not when hard i dont realy no were to begin looking for problems!
1 voltage ?
2 the pt2399?
3 regulator?
Ok thanks
Yes check the IC voltages, particularly the voltage at PT2399 pin 1. I expect these will be ok actually if it's semi working but still it may help pinpoint the issue.
DeleteSome PT2399s are just noisy unfortunately, so if you've socketed and have some spares I'd try swaping the IC and see if that makes any difference
Thanks for the respons
ReplyDeleteIv checked the voltage at pin 1 iv got 5.23 so you are probaly right or should i adjust it down?
Or just change the pt2399?
Anything over 5V can cause problems for the PT2399 so you need to change the regulator. Have you used a 78L05 for it? You may have damaged the IC, but change the reg first then you can check.
DeleteOk yes iv used the 78L05
ReplyDeleteI will change that and the pt2399. Do the get damaged if the are getting to much voltage?
Il get back to you when all is replaced and checkd.that will take some time !!
Its bedtime for my kids so it will take som time :)
The PT2399s can be noisy and temperamental anyway, and whilst I don't know that greater than 5V would definitely damage it, it's certainly won't have done it any favours. That's why I always socket ICs, so in instances like this I can always swap between a lot and choosse the quietest.
DeleteI have now changed 78l05 tested a couple but the voltage was still over 5 it was about 5.39. I then changed the rrsistor from 9v in to regulator so i got it working at 5.03 then i changed pt2399, hooked everthing up but no...still the same problem at low volume it sound great and organik but when i turn up the volume on the guittar the pedal starts to distort. Any ideas ?? Anybody?.. Its so wired that it sounds good when it gats a low volume frome the guitar but not when it gets louder
DeleteI thinke that iv found my answer to my problem in bjorns own description above. there he mentions that
Delete"There should be no distortion or tone coloration as long as input level is in range below maximum allowed."
This is exact my problem my input signal is to high into the circiet and there for it distorts. The question now is how do i change my input. Is it by changing the input filter cap? think it is 22nf or does that just change the range not the qantitude of the signal?
ok thanks sorry for my crapy sweidsh school english, hope you understand me
hey mark, making another one of these guys this time without the tap just for some studio work. would it be possible to add an led to flash in time?
ReplyDeleteMark is away until the week end mate.
DeleteAh no worries.
ReplyDeletei'm having trouble with the mix pot on my build. Used a 50k linear as shown, but maybe i messed up a resistor or something. The mix is still much too loud when the knob is all the way down. I cannot get a subtle delay sound at all. It does go above unity when maxed out, which is nice, but its too loud to get anything close to a subtle delay. Is there a resistor I can mess with or check to get this pot functioning more how I want it?
ReplyDeleteI also noticed that you said this above "And I swapped the 12K at the volume control for a 5K1 as well. I did this one because with a 12K you can never drop the repeats below unity, and I wanted the ability to make them quieter than the dry signal if I wanted to." I dont know if that's what you meant though- because not being able to have repeats below unity would be ridiculous- but maybe this is where I need to look?
Thanks so much Mark!
Hi Mark, how i could use the delay pot with an extra output for expression pedal..!! I Think it is a great idea.!!!
ReplyDeleteExpression pedals tend to have one of the lugs grounded and then the other lug and the wiper to a tip and ring of the socket. So you could add a stereo socket to the DBD, and take what is the expression pedal wiper to Delay 1, and what is the non-grounded lug of the expression pedal to Delay 2 & 3. The only thing is that this will effectively be putting two resistors in parallel which will obviously affect the values, so it may be better to use a DPDT switch (or stomp) to select either the pot or the expression pedal. A nice bonus with that is that you could then effectively switch between two values on the fly.
DeleteI guess i can do it with or without the DBD.. I don't need the tap tempo sw if i can set the time from the expression pedal.. i think its something very easy to do.. Thanks Mark.!!
DeleteBuilt this tonight, subbed a tl062 for the op275/ad712, it works well enough though probably a bit lo-fi compared to the original. I also connected the wiper of the delay pot with lug 1 rather than lug 3, it seems more natural to me to ha ve the delay rate increase when turning clockwise. Also there are 6 links not 5, just in case it leads to someone not noticing the 2 links in 1 hole.
ReplyDeleteDoh, how haven't I seen that after all this time! And I agree with you about the Delay pot.
DeleteI just got done building one of these and it's SO GREAT!
ReplyDeleteThanks for the layout!
Built two of these today, borth worked straight away. Used the OP275, got them from musikding fairly cheap. Had to use 2x180k for that 360k resistor, doh! Heres some photos of the boards for your collection Mark:
ReplyDeletehttps://dl.dropbox.com/u/2828668/reaperpedals/deepbluedelay_front.JPG
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/2828668/reaperpedals/deepbluedelay_back.JPG
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/2828668/reaperpedals/deepbluedelay_x2.JPG
And damn this sounds gooood! Thanks for the layout mate!
Excellent job, cheers for the pics Jimmie
DeleteForgot about the Delay pot, sorted that afterwards with the increasing and turning.
DeleteWhen i watch the pics i see that it's a mystery it's no short on the back. Hidious solderwork haha. my iron tip is getting really bad, need to change that, maybe it's time to invest in a proper solderstation. Hate those multilayer caps that have 3-pin spacing instead of two, had to bend them a bit. Currently working on the Belton reverb, couldnt stop working even tho time is almost 3am here haha.
Yes I know exactly what you mean about those caps. I bought quite a few of them, and although some do have the desired 2.5mm pitch, there are plenty that are 5mm. Don't they realise we have poly caps for 5mm pitches?! I'm extra careful now, and you can find them in 2.5mm if you shop around.
Deleteso here's my build of this! left vero is the deep blue. this thing was crazy tight to box but i made it at last haha.
ReplyDeletehttps://dl.dropbox.com/u/2828668/reaperpedals/dennis/inside.jpg
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/2828668/reaperpedals/dennis/front.jpg
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/2828668/reaperpedals/dennis/front_2.jpg
I've read about the ability to put an effects loop send and return so that the effect in the loop only affects the delay's repeats... anyone got any idea how to implement this?
ReplyDeleteif you'd like to have darker repeats you can change the 15n capacitor on the bottom two rows with higher values- I like the original repeats flavor some, but i'm definitely a fan of the darker sounding stuff... using a 33n doesnt make it much darker- i put 3 values on a dpdt with the 15n in the middle so that the outside lugs caps are added to the 15n... really putting a slightly higher value there reduces noise quite a bit at higher delay times! very good sounds in all three positions- extremely useful mod!
now if I could put tap tempo and an effects loop this would be ballin outta control!
I just built one of these (have built one before- and wanted another actually) but I'm having major problems with this one. I try not to ask for help on here, but I'm thinking it could be a batch of bad pt2399's from tayda. I am getting no delay signal at all, i just get this nasty distortion sound thats like something is getting overloaded. I've gone over my layout like 20 times and tested as much as possible. would this be a symptom of bad pt2399's or maybe bad 78l05's?
ReplyDeleteVoltage at the 5V out of 78L05 would be my first thing to check. PT2399 won't work right at all if the voltage from the regulator is something else and not exactly 5V.
DeleteYour symptoms remind me of the trouble i had with Little Angel and the regulator. Once the regulator burned, the sound came through heavily boosted and muddy. Once i swapped the 78L05 for 7805A it tamed down. 7805A is the same regulator, but can handle current up to 1A. So if you have microscopic short after the regulator, it's sure to burn with higher than 100mA current drawn by that short..
Measure the voltage and swap the regulator to begin with...
+m
awesome... by microscopic short you mean like how the resistance between the rows of the vero can get your multimeter to kinda try to beep (when checking for continuity)? Ive tried like 5 different 78L05's... old and new
ReplyDeleteweird thing is I've built this before with no problem... is there anything i can do like eliminate the microscopic short?
Knifing the gaps could be one. How about the voltage on regulator's 5V pin?
Delete+m
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteYeh I'm getting like 8.9v out of every one of my 78l05's... I've tried knifing the traces.. replacing resistors... everything... just weird cuz i've already successfully built this circuit.
ReplyDeletei looked at the midfi clarinot layout and noticed taht there is a 1n4001 diode between the 9v and the input of the 78l05... would replacing the resistor there with a diode possibly cure my ailments? i'm waiting on 7805's but am growing impatient!
If you're getting 8,9V out of every 78L05, then they are all already broken. PT2399 doens't work with anything else than 5V, so you must have had a short before the kinfe, and that could have burned all your regulators.
DeleteI think 1N4001 or 1N5817 as polarity protection soldered in the middle of the 9V wire (marked end towards the circuit) is not a bad idea to give some extra protection, but that won't fix your broken regulators.
+m
I'm having trouble with the repeats. The first is as loud as it should be, but the remaining repeats' volume are really low. Any ideas?
ReplyDeleteMade 3 boards, all 3 have the same problem. I only get clean signal, even without the PT2399 and power supply, the volume knob is working all others are dead. I checked row 7 if there is a continuity, which maybe causing input and output to be shorted, but its fine. What could be causing it? am going totally mad trying to troubleshoot this one.Any help?
ReplyDelete/
What voltages are you getting at all the IC pins and the regulator?
DeleteHi Mark today after changing 8 PT2399s I got heavy distorted motorboating on 2. But no delay . The voltages are as follows-
ReplyDeletePT2399-
Pin 1- 5.00 Pin 9- 4.81
Pin 2- 2.50 Pin 10- 0.57
Pin 3- 0 Pin 11- 0.56
Pin 4- 0 Pin 12- 4.78
Pin 5- 3.35 Pin 13- 3.23
Pin 6- 2.49 Pin 14- 0.08
Pin 7- 4.58 Pin 15- 4.99
Pin 8- 4.58 Pin 16- 0.03
At 78L05-
I- 8.79
G-0
O-5.01
What's the problem...are the voltages ok? or are all PT2399s faulty?
What about the other IC?
DeleteOh sorry....here it is, I used a NE-5532
DeletePin 1- 4.2
Pin 2- 4.09
Pin 3- 4.14
Pin 4- 0
Pin 5- 4.14
Pin 6- 4.16
Pin 7- 4.10
Pin 8- 8.39
Are the readings ok?
Verified!
ReplyDeleteThe Mix is still loud at Minimum
Sound Fantastic and self-occilatory!!
Mark,
ReplyDeleteI built two of the dbd and both turned out successful
but the only things is that it attenuates alot presence
How can i improve this?
Try experimenting with the 2n2 caps between 13 & 14, and 15 & 16. Lower values should brighten it up.
DeleteYou are the MAN !!!
ReplyDeleteThanks a lot!!
I was talking about the dry signal being attenuated
ReplyDeletewill the mod around PT2399 work?
Any decent subs for the AD712/OP275? Can't seem to find them anywhere as cheap as i'd like.
ReplyDeleteShould work with any dual opamp. AD712 and OP275 are high end audio amplifiers, so they are a bit pricier than your average ICs. But do they sound better than TL072? Some seem to think so - Some may even swear that it is so.
DeleteYou could try NE5532, LM8333, LF442 or LF353. Those are usually good in any circut, so i don't see any reason why they shouldn't sound good here..
Other cheap subs would be TL072, TL082, TL062, TLC2272, TLC2262, JRC4558 and so on.
+m
Awesome, appreciate it
ReplyDeleteHaving some issues with this one. All i'm getting is a muddy fuzz sound and the voltage regulator is scorching hot. Sometimes it sounds like it's doing an octave down effect...ha. I'm using a 50k lin for the volume, but i wouldn't think that would really do anything. Any idea why that regulator is so hot?
ReplyDeleteWhat voltages are you getting at the regulator and all the IC pins?
DeleteHey Mark
ReplyDeleteI'm having noise issues and hope someone can help. Pedal works properly but I'm getting a good bit of noise when I turn up the mix knob and I when I turn the delay knob I'm getting a steady sputter. Voltage at 1 on the pt2399 is 5.02. Using a op275 and a 78l05. Does this sound like a bad pt2399 or something else.
Hi mark I have been trying to figure out what I have done wrong with this one for a long time. A little embarrassed to say how long. Volume is the only pot working and does not cut the signal to zero. I am getting a boost from the pedal but no delay. I have tried several pt2399s. I am getting 5v at pin 1. Is their anything down stream from pin 1 that would help trouble shoot this? Any other suggestions. Thanks, any help is appreciated.
ReplyDeleteHere are my voltage readings...
DeletePt2399:
1. 4.96
2. 2.487
3. .2mv
4. .2mv
5. 3.372
6. 2.487
7. 4.57
8. 4.57
9. 128.7 mv
10. 4.29
11. 4.31
12. 128.4 mv
13. 1.72
14. 4.91
15. 108 mv
16. 5.63
Ad712jn:
1. 3.96
2. 3.96
3. 3.95
4. .1 mv
5. 3.95
6. 3.965
7. 3.95
8. 7.91
Well there must be something physically wrong with the build because you've got voltage on all the ground pins. Pin 4 of the AD712 and pins 3 and 4 of the PT2399 should be 0 volts. Any sort of reading there is suspect, particularly seeing as the reading is between those pins and another point of ground which shows there is a potential difference between those two points. Check all your ground soldering of all points including offboard. You must have a problem with that or an unwanted short somewhere to get that reading.
DeleteWell, after checking voltages I plugged the pedal in again and it works, 100% no issues???
DeleteI don't remember cleaning any traces. Maybe a pot lug was hitting the ground... Thanks again for your help.
DeleteGlad you got it sorted out
DeleteJust finished the circuit, and, yeahhh, works like a dream!
ReplyDeleteA few notes:
- Used the NE5532. Great, first build using this and couldn't be more happy with it.
- After building the DrBoogie with Mylar caps, and gettin' an absolute noise free pedal, i decided to use these too on de DBD. Works great with no noise at all.
- First PT2399 used: No problem at all related to noise or strange behaviour. Purchased 5 ones in Tayda just in case, and now I have 4 resting at the bag.
Don't really needed a delay, I use the EHX #1Echo, but hell, the DBD is really a great delay, will give it a chance with no problem.
When I finish the box, I'll post some pics. Will use a 125B.
BR
Pedal finished and working fineeee. Pics for your collection:
ReplyDeletehttp://img268.imageshack.us/img268/9708/dbdking.jpg
http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/4420/dbdguts.jpg
Hope you like'em :)
Best regards
Excellent stuff. They look familiar! :o)
DeleteThis is a real family :P
Deletehttp://imageshack.us/a/img59/9309/capincfam3.jpg
Next Station: Wampler Triple Wreck :)
By the way, you're the absolut winner, 9 of these 15 pedals have your designed veros and the triple wreck will do so too, so 10-6, the winner issss Markkk! :P
DeleteAwesome family pic!
Deleteis "33r" a normal resistor? do i have to connect mix 1 to the pot then to the ground?
ReplyDeleteJust another note.
ReplyDeleteAs I was in need of some urgent 2N5457, (I destroyed the Cmatmods Tremoglo one) had to go to Conectrol, one of the biggest component stores in Madrid downtown as they were not available at my local store.
Besides the 2N5457 (great price, 11 cents/ unit)and some BC182-L that I will need for the Meathead (4 cents each) asked if they had the AD712 in stock.
It was available and not very expensive, 4,25 euro/ unit so I purchased one to try it in the Deep Blue Delay. I was curious about installing a HiFi ic on an effect's pedal.
Well, after tryin' the unit for more than an hour.... I can hear no difference with the NE5532. Let's say, the AD712 works fine, is a great ic but I think that there's no need at all to install an opamp of this price and quality in the DBD, Really you can't hear any difference.
So my advice is: If you want to use the AD712, feel free to do it so, but with the NE5532 you'll get the same spound and you'll get 20 for the price of just one AD.
BR
I've never noticed much if any difference with opamp swaps with any pedal that stays clean, to the point where I wouldn't even bother experimenting with them now. In dirt pedals it's a different matter altogether because the opamp characteristics have an impact on how the effect distorts, but no I'd be more than happy to stick with the NE5532 in a delay pedal too and not use anything more expensive with no obvious benefit.
Deleteok so built, with a few small changes (used which caps and resistors I have that were closest..) and i get a reverb like sound, and the delay and repeat knobs change the sound or make the sound stop, but dont do what they are supposed to. mix and volume dont really work.. Kind of a mess. lol. The pt2399 is getting 5.02v at pin 1, so im pretty confused.. Did my value subs cause this?
ReplyDeleteIf the subs were all close it's unlikely. Check the voltages of all the other IC pins and post them
DeleteIt's repeating now and all the knobs work as they should, but I'm getting high pitched whine in the sound and the repeats are extremely distorted, like, almost bitcrushed. lol
ReplyDeleteopa2134pa:
1 3.72
2 3.70
3 3.67
4 0
5 7.43
6 3.69
7 3.66
8 3.67
Pt2399:
1 6.5
2 3.24
3 0
4 0
5 3.60
6 3.25
7 4.84
8 2.17
9 3.25
10 3.25
11 3.26
12 3.73
13 6.26
14 0.54
15 0.05
16 0.01
and i've put 4 different 78l05 in and all 4 had the exact same 6.5 coming out of them.
ReplyDeletenow I've got it at 5v with a new pt2399 and im getting super high pitched noise that changes in frequency with the repeat and time knobs
ReplyDelete:/
I finished this tonight, waited 2 weeks for my PT2399s to come from Tayda with fingers itching to get it done. It worked first time and sounds great, i subbed an NE5532 for the OP275 as suggested above and an L7805CV (that was giving spot on 5v) for the 78L05 (coz i couldn't wait any longer for the L05s). I'll get it boxed at some point this week.
ReplyDeleteThanks for posting this one Mark, much appreciated.
James
You'll love it for sure. It's really one of the nicest delays I've ever tried. Did you hear any noticeable differences between the NE5532 and the OP275? I've swapped many times the NE5532 and the AD712 with different guitars, amps and effects and still can't find any difference.
DeleteHi JaviCAP
DeleteI didn't have an OP275 to try but i'm so happy with the way it sounds as is i'll stick with it.
GOT IT WORKING! sounds great, very analog sounding.
ReplyDeleteWhat parts effect the amount of repeats I'll have, I had to sub a few values for what I had and it will not reach oscilation.
Is there an opamp other than the two suggested that would work in the DBD, or are they the only two?
ReplyDeleteMark, any low distortion dual op amp will work. I used a burr brown and it sounds great!
DeleteThanks, Mike, do you have a part number so I can order from Tayda, or in worst case, Maplins?
ReplyDeleteOPA2134PA
ReplyDeleteNice one, Mike, and thanks again.
DeleteIs it poss to reduce a 100 k lin pot to 50 k? I have three doing nothing and it would save me having to buy them.
ReplyDeleteI checked on google, apparently, two 50k between lugs 1-2-3 should do the trick. But I'd like you guys to verify that, you know what you're talking about.
DeleteYou got it correct. There is just easier way to achieve that. Just solder one 100K resistor between lugs one and three. That makes it 50K pot.
DeleteThe idea is that you basically have two resistors in parallel. If they are the same value, then they halve the value of one.
You could also source 50K pots, as they are very common value :)
+m
Don't forget that if you do the 100k resitor with a line pot, it will become a log pot.
ReplyDeleteBR
Thanks, Miro and Javi, your knowledge is invaluable.
ReplyDeleteJust to be absolutely sure (as the Big Muff circuit worked perfectly, but transistors can be flipped to the other side of the board without changing connections): If I mount the components on the opposite side of the perfboard, the actual perfboard circuit side would be mirrored, right? Otherwise the IC pins won't match up to the correct positions (...right?).
ReplyDeleteI'm lovin this one, a big pat on the back for you Mark.
ReplyDeletehttp://ubuntuone.com/1Oj9v12C7B9BtCKfKOkJwE
Thanks
James
Hi! Built this one last night and it sounds really nice! However the repeats are still loud when I have the mix all way down and I read that others also talked about this. Is it something in the design or is it me who made something wrong? Otherwise everything works great and its not a big deal, but it´s hard to get a really "subtle" delay.
ReplyDeleteThanks, Kim
Noticed another strange thing when I tested a little. It behaves in different ways depending on what guitar I plug in to it, or what other pedals that is in front of it. With some setups I can get it occilating and with other I can´t... strange... It sounds great though. Anyone have an idea? This beats me and I´ve checked everything several times now.
DeleteFound the problem, one resistor to the wrong place... Now it works perfect! Thanks for this great layout!
DeleteI'm with Mark, I'm not getting full oscillation with repeats maxed. Would fooling with the 22n or 5k resistor feeding the repeat pot do the trick, or can you just increase the pot to 75k or 100k be the way to go? Otherwise, this is a perfect delay (in my opinion). Thanks for all your hard work!
ReplyDeletethink i posted my combined build with a belton brick reverb and this delay in a 1590BB before, heres a stripepd down version with the delay only in a 1590B, it's actually really tight inside but no big worries really. layed down all the electrolytics on the board.
ReplyDeletehttps://dl.dropbox.com/u/2828668/deceiving_delay.jpg
Nice job, I saw this yesterday on FB :o)
DeleteHi,
ReplyDeletei built this today, and it has sound , right, but it's clean, it doesn't seem to echo nothing, and on some chords i've a motorboat noise like other comments owners.
I've about 4v on the pin1 of the pt2399 (i've use different brand of component and you will say that's pretty stupid , and i agree...i've used axial capacitor instead radial on some parts, the less part is where there's a black line?, i've that's not the case, i may have found a mistake..)
Kind regards
David
Hi Mark and Miro!
ReplyDeleteSince I had some trouble getting this to work (wrong hole for a resistor) and it took some time before I got it working, I spent some time checking the schematics that you made this layout from (and some other schematics as well...) I actually found one thing that was hard to spot but is missing in your layout. It´s a diode for voltage protection at the 9v input. It appears on the layout but it´s hard to spot because it´s hand drawn. I just put a 1n4001 inline with the 9v input. It doesn´t really matter if you don´t have it but I thought I´d mention it anyway since it´s a good protection for wrong voltage.
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j6/IvIark_2006/Layouts/Schematics/volume_mod.png
I will add it to mine !
DeleteThanks !
Hi all!
ReplyDeleteI built this pedal, sounds great but when i pick the strings hard, the sound becomes distorted.
What causes this? and how can i repair it?
Thanks!
yap! same thing with mine build.. Any suggestions?
ReplyDeleteHey folks!
ReplyDeleteLooking forward to building this one, but need clarification.
What exactly does "double link at pt2399 pin3" mean? What links where? What's with the little blue circle?
Hello and welcome.
DeleteYou see the link wires on the cut guide board - the black lines. Double link (the blue circle) means that you'll need to solder two link wires to the same hole. In this case, the sixth column has two links. One from row 10 to row 13 and the other from row 13 to row 14.
+m
Ooooh! :)
DeleteI see... will get right on it when my pt2399s come in the mail. Currently working on one or two (four, actually :) ) TBE builds.
Thanks Miro!
I just finished building this today, and when engaged I get a slight volume boost, but no repeats. I wired it up to use a battery as opposed to a wall wart. Will this circuit work on battery power? Also, when testing voltage at the various IC pins, do you want the IC in the socket, or can you test with the chip removed, using only the contacts in the socket?
ReplyDeleteThanks,
Shawn.
It will work on battery but probably not for very long and the regulator needs a minimum voltage of around 7V to perform properly. So it could be the problem if the battery is low, you'd need to measure the IC and regulator pin voltages to see if that offers any clues
DeleteRegulator was 7v (in) and 4.97v (out). I assume since I've got clean boost but no controls that the opamp is working. I've got a bunch of parts scheduled to arrive today. I'll try swapping out the PT2399 and if that doesn't work, I'll start replacing caps... I already checked for cold solder joints and bridges.
Deleteanyone can help me,.... I have finished build this one, the sound is pretty good, all the pots work fine, but when my friend test it in the big amp and when the pedal turn on there's arise "dug" on the spiker but it was happen when the pedal on and after that the sound is normal, I just want to know where it was from,.... thanx
ReplyDeleteFor the life of me, I cannot seem to get this to work. I don't understand the issue, as all of my voltages look good on both ICs (as far as I can tell), but I get nothing but static through the board, no matter what I do. I double-checked and reflowed all of my solder joints, made sure there were no solder bridges, verified that all parts were solidly attached, verified the polarity of all my electrolytic caps, tried different pots, different ICs, and different voltage regulators, same thing. This is driving me nuts.
ReplyDeleteHave you used an audio probe before? If you use one and follow the circuit through it will show you exactly where the problem is coming in and should make it much easier to diagnose.
DeleteIvIark -
DeleteI've never used an audio probe, not sure how it works. Is that something I would build myself, or would I have to purchase it?
Nevermind, just did a search at diystompboxes.com and saw some pictures... I'll try that this evening.
DeleteWow, I've just spent the last hour playing with this after finishing it and in case you didn't hear me the first time - WOW! I built this based on the recommendations of a few people and it has not disappointed, it's everything I was looking for from a delay. If you're wondering whether you should try it then stop thinking about it and pick up the soldering iron.
ReplyDeleteI totally agree on that, it´s a great delay! And it works perfect for an acoustic guitar as well. It´s in my rig for both the electric and the acoustic right now and together with the compulator in my acoustic rig it´s just a perfect match. I think I have to build another one so I don´t have to take it between my pedal cases.
DeleteJust built this, like the others have mentioned.. WOW
ReplyDeleteWould it be okay to use a 390R instead of the 360R? It's the closest I got.
ReplyDeleteYou mean 360K? I bet you won't hear any difference. That particular resistor sets the gain for first opamp stage, so 330K would be ok too.
Delete+m
I mean 360K. Thanks.
DeleteThanx Mark, finally It's just finish.Four month ago I abandon this after fail for my 2nd attempt. Then start again, and finally i found my mistake. I just miss-reading your layout, I thought that row 6 (coloum 1-6)"is ground", not "toward ground" (usually in layout, ground label means it is grund), so I put -9v and -input to this hole (newbie stupidity). The result is noisy distortion sound and the regulator voltage around 8.6. Then I saw other vero schematic where there is a jumper from regulator ground to OP275 pin 4. So I make a jumper from row 6 coloum 1 to the lowest row, and DONE...CLEAN and COOL SOUND. Thx Thx Thx
ReplyDeleteYes there are a few layouts that need 2 ground connections on here to save a column of width, although I have been going through some of them like the muffs to put the link in. I think I will modify this one too because it will still only be 18 columns wide and so easily fit in a 1590B.
DeleteDoes anyone get a pop sound when the effect is turned on?
ReplyDeleteThis is going to be my next build so I can't comment on the circuit specifics yet, but I can tell you that generally I solve LED popping issues by doing this
Deletehttp://www.muzique.com/lab/led.htm
With high-gain effects the popping can have a different source but I'm not into high-gain effects so I won't be going into details on that one.
This is a good read, though:
http://www.geofex.com/article_folders/bypass/bypass.htm
Hmmmm.. The pop does not seem to come from the LED, when i disconnected the LED there was still a pop. I'll recheck my soldering on the pull down resistor. Thanks for the links btw!
DeleteCould it be that i need a pull-down resistor connecting the voltage regulator output to ground?
DeleteThat can't be it.
DeleteThe board has 1M pulldown for the input and 100K pulldown for the output...
+m
I sometimes resort to using a pulldown from output to ground and I just wire it straight on the 3PDT. It never cut the pop completely but did make it slightly better. You can also try having a pulldown resistor on both input and output.
DeleteNo idea what the problem was, i just rewired the pots and the popping stopped.
DeleteI only got one repeat with my build, the repeat pot don't make anything.
ReplyDeleteAny solution? Thanks
Go through basic debugging procedure.. Could be a short between the strips and bad pot/component. Latter is not that common, but it can hapen too..
Delete+m
I completely checked all the basic things, the pot don't do anything on sound. I really don't understand for what it just do 1 repeat and cut, really strange! Perhaps a bad resistor. I finded on this thread a person that had the same problem, but I don't saw his solution.
DeleteJohn F. Klaver Band had the exact same problem and he had forgotten the 5K1 resistor. Is that resistor in the correct holes, or is it the correct value?
DeleteOkay wrong hole, now it's sound perfect!
DeleteHello Mark and all!
ReplyDeleteI've just finished building DBD and I'm having issues with the circuit. I'm not sure as to what people mean by "motorboating" but this just may be it. A weird buzzing sound drowning out all other sounds?
Anyhoo, perhaps someone can help me out here, this is my first PT2399 build so be gentle :)
Using an audioprobe and referring to this schematic
http://s76.beta.photobucket.com/user/IvIark_2006/media/Layouts/Schematics/volume_mod.png.html
I can tell you the following
- 78L05 gives out 4.99V, which is also the voltage on PT2399 pin 1
- tracing the schematic (noting that IC2a and IC2b are swapped on vero vs the schematic) I can trace the undistorted sound through 180k (mine is 183k, I didn't have 180k so I used 150k and 33k in series), into pin 2 of the opamp, out of the pin 1 and coming into 22k resistor (22k/20k voltage divider before going into pin 6 of the opamp). This is really strange because there's no sound _after_ 22k resistor (no sound on pin 6 opamp input) which results in pin 7 (opamp output) humming (motorboating?). 22k resistor actually measures 22k (so it's not faulty/mislabeled), yet there's no sound on opamp pin 6???
- V+ on OP275 is 8,47V but since the first opamp works fine, I'm guessing the operating voltage is fine? Missing half a volt is dropped on 33R on 9V line so I'm guessing that's by design?
Any ideas? It's getting kinda late here and I've been building for a while now so I may be missing an obvious problem but I'm simply drawing a blank here...
Anyone?
DeleteWell something connected to pin 6 must be pulling it down so you're going to have to start testing components and checking your soldering around there. The volume pot and 5K1 resistor could be the issue, but we know the layout works which points to a build error or faulty component, and so swapping them out to attempt to find the culprit is needed.
DeleteThanks Mark!
DeleteI've just completed building the Clarinot tonight (building several effects at once can't be good for one's focus and concentration :) ) so I didn't get around to checking out the DBD and your suggestions. I'll get on it tomorrow evening and report back.
OK it's fixed. It turned out to be a faulty opamp in OP275. I swapped it out for another one from the same Bitsbox shipment and that was it.
DeleteThe troubleshooting also revealed a packing error on behalf of Banzai because I wired all the pots without checking (without much thought, took out 3 B50k's and assumed the one that's left must be the B25k) and whaddyaknow, that B25k wasn't a B25k but a B2k. :)
Now, two observations:
- when Repeat is maxed out, DBD immediately runs off into self-oscillation every single time. What can I do to prevent it from happening? It's only the last 10% of the pot but I'd like to avoid it if at all possible.
- Mix pot... I can get fully dry signal on one end of the pot but I cannot get fully wet signal on the other end? Is this by design? Dry signal is always very prominent and the mix pot seems to affect only the superimposed wet signal by making it quieter or louder. Is this normal? Sometimes it's useful to have 100% wet signal and I can't seem to get it out of DBD. Is it even possible?
The oscillation is normal. The mix isn't really a proper mix between wet and dry. It's more like a delay volume knob which doesn't affect the dry signal.
DeleteThanks man!
DeleteSo I guess it is what it is and apparently it's working properly. :)
Good to know!
hi
ReplyDeleteIm thinking of putting this in a box with a reverb ( box of hall )...any problems seen doing this ??? im planning to use the output of one stomp to the input of the other ??
I think Rudeez has done at least one of those combos...
Delete+m
I'm about to do one big box, one Clarinot into another Clarinot into Deep Blue Delay.
DeleteShould be interesting! :)
As Miro said ive done it three times by now i think. although that is with a GGG vero for the reverb but it should definately be doable with the box of hall as well.
Deleteheres a pic inside one of mine:
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/2828668/reaperpedals/deceived%20delay%20and%20reverb/custom%20timothy/dbd_ggg_verb.jpg
I like those wire loops, I just keep forgetting to leave an extra column every time. :)
DeleteDo you thread, then bend, then solder or do you solder, then bend, then thread? Obviously I still lack experience in certain areas because I normally leave my wires waaaay too long, verify that circuit is working and that I actually want to keep it and only then start thinking how am I going to be able to fit it inside a box. :)
Much desoldering occurs and I usually end up with a few wires being too short. If I go this way then I'd be desoldering at the pot/switch side of things which would leave me with precious little maneuvering space... what's the pro tip on these matters?
Thanks for the help Guys, think I might go with the Rebote and box of hall purely because its smaller than the deep blue....I do have a couple of pretty large boxes and a huge wedge shape enclosure that could fit multiple effects I got from a job lot. if I went for a combo of effects say. reverb, delay, od and booster, all with there own stomp switch, bearing in mind, all of these could thearetically be used at once, Im wondering abt power supply.....would it work, or would it need some sort of electrics to boost the juice ??
DeleteWell that depends entirely on what kind of power source you had in mind. As long as your brick can supply enough amperes, you'll be fine. You can either measure the current draw from your particular effects or you can google for typical values and then calculate in some overhead.
DeleteI'd also look into some decoupling...
I finished this yesterday, and all I get is my guitar signal boosted with distortion. And when I turn the Repeats up, it starts to hum with an ascending pitch..very similar to the sound you normally get when you turn the Time knob quickly. The Mix controls the overall volume of any sound coming out, while the Delay does nothing.
ReplyDeleteI have 5V on regulator. I swapped for IC1 and IC2 and 78L05 just to make sure. Same problem. And they're for sure all good. Haven't found any shorts.
Any thoughts?
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteVoltages:
DeleteIC2
1=5v 2=2.5v 3=0v 4=0v 5=2.9v 6=2.5v 7=0.8v 8=0.8v
9=2.5v 10=2.5v 11=2.5v 12=2.5v 13=2.5v 14=.2-2.5v while turning Repeats knob 15=2.5v 16=2.5v
IC1
1=4.3v 2=4.3v 3=4.3v 4=0v 5=4.3v 6=4.3v 7=4.2v 8=8.47
Pin 14 on the PT seems strange (jumps from .2v to 2.5v as soon as a start turning Repeats up from 0) so I've replaced a few caps and resistors that I suspect could drop the voltage. But maybe it's coming from somewhere else?
Could the pot be shorting inside? Can't think of any other reason why swapping ICs don't change anything...
Delete+m
No, I tried replacing the pot too.
DeleteJust built this and it works beautifully!! Thank you thank you for all the great layouts. I'm so excited to have built my first delay!
ReplyDeleteHi,
ReplyDeleteI have finished it and it sounds ok, but i have a little problem. When the volume is on zero there is also sound.
Is it normal?
Yes that is as it should be. If you want to go down to nothing then it would need to be slightly modded, but I didn't think it necessary because that would take you entire signal path below unity which I can't imagine anyone doing.
DeleteThanks for fast replaying. I look into the scheme. There is no sound thru volume pot ,but it still remains
ReplyDeletesound from OP275. That means volume pot only adds or removes additional sound.
No, the volume pot acts as a simple variable resistor in the feedback loop of the last opamp. If you wanted a conventional volume control you'd remove the pot as shown in the layout and the 5K1 resistor attached to Vol 1. Add a 12K resistor between pins 6 and 7 of the top opamp, change the Volume pot to 100K log, take the output wire from the board to Volume 3, Volume 1 to ground, and Volume 2 is then the new output to the stomp switch.
DeleteOK,thanks a lot for help.
ReplyDeleteHi,made this one and it worked first pop !Read all the comments about noise and hiss so used all poly caps and its quiet as a mouse.Thanks, nice Delay...elay...lay..ay. ay..
ReplyDeleteFinished two of these today. Hopefully i get to keep one :)
ReplyDeletehttp://mirosol.kapsi.fi/varasto/boxes/DBD3.jpg
http://mirosol.kapsi.fi/varasto/boxes/DBD4.jpg
+m
DeleteYou really do like your knobs transparent... :)
That's great... myself, right now I'm trying to match the leds to the knob color, I guess I'm gonna need to start experimenting with rgb leds.
I got a fair batch of those. They do seem to look good on everything. I might just get couple hundred more :P
Delete+m
Started up on the first try. Stoked :)
ReplyDeletehttps://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/149220_10151546061384617_1054973904_n.jpg
Now to box it. Blue pot caps, unfinished box and a pink led incoming.
Nice job
DeleteThanks, Mark. And thanks a lot for all you do. You've opened up a brave new world for me.
DeleteBoxed:
https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/39282_10151546366209617_1657258257_n.jpg
My DBD is working beautifully, but ab:ing withe the original I found out that the max delay time is shorter in mine. Can this be adjusted changing some components or the pot?
ReplyDeleteIncreasing the value of the pot should make it longer but also when you get to longer delay times, it just gets dirtier.
DeleteI'm interested in knowing if you can hear any difference between the noisiness of the delay trails of the clone and the original one? I mean, there shouldn't. Just check!